Light blogging today but word is breaking from the Vatican of step one in what could be a dramatic reunification and end of Schism of the SSPX. See For the record - Latest Tornielli: "Fellay's response has arrived; it is positive"
Tuesday, April 17, 2012
Breakthrough In Reunification of Society of Saint Pius X and the Catholic Church ?
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POPE CONTRADICTS BIBLE, CARDINAL LEVADA ISSUES NO CLARIFICATION. EXPECTS OFFICAL CLARIFICATION FROM BISHOP FELLAY
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2012/04/pope-contradicts-bible-cardinal-levada.html
SSPX WEBSITE: ' I believe in three baptisms for the forgiveness of sins’ ?
So when the SSPX bishops and priests recite their Oath of Fidelity to Pope Benedict XVI and they are asked to say aloud the Nicene Constantinople Creed, which we pray in Church, they will say 'I believe in one baptism for the forgiveness of sin’ and mean ‘I believe in three baptism for the forgiveness of sin, the baptism of water, desire and blood’.
Fr. Joseph Pfeiffer on the SSPX website,THE THREE BAPTISMS writes that Fr.Leonard Feeney in his 1952 book, Bread of Life, states on p.25:
It is now: Baptism of Water, or damnation! If you do not desire that Water, you cannot be justified. And if you do not get it, you cannot be saved."
Yes without the baptism of water no one on earth can be saved and we cannot give anyone the baptism of desire or judge who has a genuine baptism of blood (martyrdom). So obviously any non Catholic you meet needs the baptism of water for salvation.So Fr.Leonard Feeney was correct.
The baptism of desire can never ever be an exception to the need for the baptism of water. Since we cannot know any such case.
So when the SSPX bishops and priests take their oarth of fidelity to Pope Benedict XVI and they are asked to recite the Nicene Constantinople Creed they will say 'I believe in one baptism for the forgiveness of sin’ and mean ‘I believe in three baptism for the forgiveness of sin, the baptism of water, desire and blood’.
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2012/04/sspx-website-i-believe-in-three.html
Cardinal Luiz Ladaria, Bishop Charles Morerod O.P Oath of Fidelity: to dissent
Profession of Faith allows for dissent on ecclesiology and baptism.
Cardinal Luiz Ladaria S.J the Secretary of the Vatican Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith has been the President of the International Theological Commission (ITC), Vatican. Bishop Charles Morerod O.P has been the Secretary of the ITC.
They have had published two papers which are available on the ITC website. In these two theological papers they have written that the Catholic Church no more teaches exclusive salvation. Since there can be those saved in invincible ignorance (LG 16) etc. So there are known exceptions to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus.
So when they made their Profession of Faith and took an Oath of Fidelty they recited the Nicene Constantinople Creed in which we pray ‘I believe in one baptism for the forgiveness of sin’. However they really meant that not every one on earth needs the baptism of water for salvation. There could be known people saved in invincible ignorance etc. So in actuality there is not one baptism of water for the forgiveness of sin. There are known exceptions in the present times.
There understanding of the Church is also different, even though in the Profession of Faith they said ‘ I believe in one holy catholic and apostolic Church.’(1)
There understanding of Church is based on the false assumption that we know cases of non Catholics saved in invincible ignorance and the baptism of desire and so Vatican Council II (LG 16) and Pope Pius XII's Letter of the Holy Office 1949 have mentioned known exceptions to exclusive salvation in only the Catholic Church.(2)
There understanding of Church (ecclesiology) is that every one on earth with no exception does not need to enter the Church for salvation. The holy catholic and apostolic Church is not necessary for the salvation of all people with no exception.
CONTINUED
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2012/04/cardinal-luiz-ladaria-bishop-charles.html#links
DOMINICAN, FRANCISCAN FRIARS OF THE IMMACULATE AND DIOCESAN PRIESTS NEGATE POPE BENEDICT’S OVERSIGHT AND THAT OF THE CONGREGATION FOR THE DOCTRINE OF THE FAITH
The pope could correct the oversight if someone asks him if we really know personal cases of non Catholics saved in invincible ignorance and the baptsm of desire.
Catholic priests in Rome have corrected an ovesight of Pope Benedict XVI and the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith (CDF). An error, the priests themself could have made unknowingly.
The Catholic priests, most of whom offer the Novus Ordo Mass, confirm that we do not know a single case of somone saved in invincible ignorance, a good conscience etc (L G 16). This is y known only to God.
This error has been made by Pope Benedict XVI in Light of the World p.107 and Cardinal Luiz Ladaria Secretary of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith in the International Theological Commission (ITC),Vatican published papers, available on the ITC website.
It was based on this error that they assumed that Vatican Council II and Pope Pius XII contradicted the ancient teaching on exclusive salvation being there in only the Catholic Church.This error was also the basis for speculation on Limbo.
This same false assumption, of visible baptism of desire and personally known cases of non Catholics saved in invincible ignorance, is made by the Society of St.Pius X (SSPX) and on this basis they refute the liberal interpretation of Vatican Council II on ecumenism and inter religious dialogue.It is also the cause of confusion on the issue of religious liberty.
continued
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2012/04/dominican-franciscan-friars-of.html#links
ECCLESIA DEI’S ADVICE TO THE INSTITUTE OF THE GOOD SHEPHERD IS SCARY
Ecclesia Dei-CDF cause of unintentional dissent and liberalism
At first communities who offer the Traditional Latin Mass are invited to enter the Church with full canonical status .The discussion on Vatican Council II is to be continued later. After a few years Ecclesia Dei recommends that they follow the Catechism of the Catholic Church; the liberal version with errors. The liberal interpretation of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith (CDF) and Ecclesia Dei assumes there is a visible baptism of desire which contradicts the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus. If the traditionalists do not accept it an ‘ecclesial rupture’ could follow.
The fault is also there with the traditionalist communities as it is with the CDF, they are not aware of the root cause of the liberal interpretation of the Catechism or Vatican Council II If they were aware - they would point out the precise error of the CDF and the problem could be resolved.
The Institute of the Good Shepherd, unlike the Society of St. Pius X (SSPX), is willing to accept Vatican Council II as a continuity with Tradition. So for them it should be easy to identify the CDF's unintentional error and to get rid of it. They can follow the Catechism of the Catholic Church which would not be difficult. The Catechism can be interpreted according to Tradition.
Much of the liberalism and dissent that we see in the Church is not just general liberalism it has a specific cause and when identified it can be corrected. It has to be corrected formally by the CDF and Ecclesia Dei.
There is hope for the future. There must come a time when Catholics understand what the precise problem is, and they ask the pope or the Curia precise questions. Presently in ignorance they are not even asking the relevant questions.
A time must come when the IGS, FSSP and SSPX shout out in frustration “There is no visible baptism of desire!”
“Only God knows who is saved in invincible ignorance!”
“You do not know a single case saved with a good conscience”
“Can you indentify who is saved with the seeds of the Word?!”
“There is nothing in the Catechism or Vatican Council II which contradicts the literal interpretation of the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus!”
“Vatican Council II says outside the church there is no salvation”
“The Catechism can be interpreted as a continuation of Tradition and you can’t fool me!”
-Lionel Andrades
___________________________________
SSPX -DICI SAYS ECCLESIA DEI HAS ASKED THE INSTITUTE OF THE GOOD SHEPHARD TO FOLLOW THE CATECHISM
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2012/04/sspx-dici-says-ecclesia-dei-has-asked.html
Monday, April 23, 2012
PREFECT OF THE SUPREME TRIBUNAL: CAN THERE BE AN ‘ECCLESIAL RUPTURE’ FOR NOT AFFIRMING ‘ A VISIBLE BAPTISM OF DESIRE’ AND A LIBERAL, IRRATIONAL INTERPRETATION OF THE CATECHISM AND VATICAN COUNCIL II ?
I appeal to Cardinal Raymond Burke, Prefect of the Supreme Tribunal, Vatican to ask Ecclesia Dei and the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith(CDF), how can we know cases of non Catholics saved in invincible ignorance or the baptism of desire?How can they also be explicit exceptions to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus as the CDF alleges.
Evidence:
1. The Secretary of the CDF Cardinal Luiz Ladaria S.J on the International Theological Commission website in two position papers states that there is no more exclusive salvation in only the Catholic Church since Vatican Council II (LG 16) and the documents of Pope Pius XII indicate that there are exceptions to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus and its literal interpretation.
2. Pope Benedict XVI in Light of the World (Ignatius) p.107 indicates that those saved in invincible ignorance etc are defacto exceptions to the dogma which taught that there is only one way of salvation and everyone needed to convert into the Church.The pope suggests that all those who are saved are saved through Jesus Christ (CCC 846) and this is the one channel. So there are explicit exceptions to the dogma and to Ad Gentes 7, Vatican Council II which says all need Catholic Faith and the baptism of water for salvation; all need to convert into the Church.CCC 846 also states all need Catholic Faith and the baptism of water for salvation (to avoid Hell).This was the one way, the centuries old interpretation of the Catholic Church.
I appeal to His Eminence Cardinal Raymond Burke to note that when we do not know any case of a person saved in invincible ignorance or the baptism of desire how can they be explicit exceptions to the dogmatic teaching on exclusive salvation being there in only the Catholic Church?
So why should there be an ‘ecclesial rupture’ between the CDF/Ecclesia Dei and the Society of St.Pius X (SSPX); why should there be this threat to the SSPX to accept Vatican Council II with this irrational interpretation of knowing cases on earth saved in invincible ignorance and a good conscience(LG 16)?
Why should the Institute of the Good Shepherd (IGS) accept the Ecclesia Dei advice to follow the Catechism of the Catholic Church when the CDF/Ecclesia Dei never clarifies how does the Catechism and Vatican Council II negate the literal interpretation of extra ecclesiam nulla salus and exclusive salvation in the Catholic Church? Vatican Council II affirms the literal interpretation of the dogma (AG 7) and there are no known exceptions(LG 16 etc). So Vatican Council II is in agreement with the SSPX position on ecumenism and other religions.
continued
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2012/04/prefect-of-supreme-tribunal-can-there.html
continued
Why cannot Catholics accept the literal interpretation of the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus and also implicit baptism of desire and invincible ignorance?
Why does the CDF/Ecclesia Dei expect Fr.Leonard Feeney’s communities, the St.Benedict Centers, also traditionalists, in Los Angeles, Worcester and Manchester,USA to assume that the baptism of desire is a defacto exception to the literal interpretation of the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus as it was interpreted by Fr.Leonard Feeney, the popes, Councils,saints, Catechisms and Vatican Council I and II ? One of the communities in Los Angeles is not being recognized it is learnt since the Archbishop and just about every body there assumes that implicit baptism of desire is explicit and so is a defacto exception to the literal interpretation of the dogma held by this Catholic community in Los Angeles.
No Magisterial document claims that the baptism of desire is an explicit exception to the dogma or that these cases can be known to us personally, and so are exceptions to the traditional teaching of exclusive salvation being there in only the Catholic Church.
I have appealed to the CDF and Ecclesia Dei through this blog and have sent them copies of these blog posts over the years, hoping they would do something about this issue but they have done nothing.Now they are issuing notices to traditionalist groups to accept their liberal heresy.Foreign lobbies are openly appealing to the pope and the CDF to change Church teaching, as if this is possible, and to penalize the traditionalists for being faithful to the teachings of the Catholic Church.
In Christ.
Mr.Lionel Andrades
Catholic Layman in Rome
E-mail: lionelandrades10@gmail.com
Wednesday, April 25, 2012
CATHOLIC PRIESTS IN ROME WHO OFFER THE NOVUS ORDO MASS IN ITALIAN UNKNOWINGLY SUPPORT THE SSPX POSITION ON OTHER RELIGIONS: THEY CONFIRM THAT THERE IS NO CASE KNOWN OF BEING SAVED IN INVINCIBLE IGNORANCE (LG 16)IN THE PRESENT TIME
So if the Letter of the Holy Office 1949 assumes that the baptism of desire contradicted the literal interpretation of the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus they made a mistake.
The participants in the Vatican-SSPX talks also did not realize that there are no explicit exceptions mentioned in Vatican Council II, to the centuries old interpretation of the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus.
Catholic priests in Rome to whom I spoke to, say that there is no known case of a non Catholic saved in invincible ignorance or the baptism of desire.Some say quite plainly that the baptism of desire etc do not contradict the literal intepretation of the dogma. Others do not want to comment further.
They know that we have returned to the centuries old intepretation of the thrice defined dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus and this is essentially the positon of the Society of St.Pius X on ecumenism and inter religious dialogue.
It means Vatican Council II (AG 7) says all need Catholic Faith and the baptism of water for salvation-just as the SSPX teaches,and there are no known exceptions, this includes invincible ignorance and a good conscience (LG 16).
So the priests are really saying, but do not want to put it into words, that Vatican Council II holds to the traditional teaching on Hindus,Jews, Buddhists,Muslims etc.
While priests who offer Mass in Italian here admit there is no visible baptism of desire there is no such comment from SSPX theologians.The SSPX bishops still believe that Vatican Council II contradicts the traditional teaching on ecumenism and other religions.Since, the bishops assume, there is a visible baptism of desire.
The Novus Ordo-priests are pointing to the traditional teaching in Vatican Council II.
-Lionel Andrades
Rome’s Msgr. Fernando Ocariz and the SSPX’s Fr. Jean-Michel Gleize assumed Lumen Gentium 16 refers to a known exception to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus and so to the SSPX position on other religions, ecumenism etc
Even theologian John Lamont who teaches theology in Sydney with the archdiocese approval did not notice it.(1)
Msgr. Fernando Ocariz an Opus Dei theologian and Fr. Jean-Michel Gleize an SSPX seminary professor of ecclesiology at Econe did not notice a key point in Vatican Council II. They just assumed that Vatican Council II contradicts the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus and so does Pope Pius XII.
Based on their interchange and failed conclusion the theologian John Lamont has written an account but also assuming the irrational, that is, we can actually know people in Heaven and somehow they are exceptions to the dogma which says there is exclusive salvation in the Catholic Church. Knowing people saved in invincible ignorance and other cases in Heaven it was assumed by Gleize, Ocariz and Lamont meant there is no more exclusive salvation in the Church. There are known exceptions (LG 16) etc.
Even the ecclesiology professor at Econe like his counterparts at the Angelicum and Gregorian University in Rome holds the liberal version of the Council and that too based on an irrationality.-Lionel Andrades
1.
Is recognizing the SSPX questioning the Council?
http://www.sspx.org/theological_commission/is_recognizing_sspx_questioning_the_council_4-19-2012.htm
PREFECT OF THE SUPREME TRIBUNAL: CAN THERE BE AN ‘ECCLESIAL RUPTURE’ FOR NOT AFFIRMING ‘ A VISIBLE BAPTISM OF DESIRE’ AND A LIBERAL, IRRATIONAL INTERPRETATION OF THE CATECHISM AND VATICAN COUNCIL II ?
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2012/04/prefect-of-supreme-tribunal-can-there.html#links
ECCLESIA DEI’S ADVICE TO THE INSTITUTE OF THE GOOD SHEPHERD IS SCARY
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2012/04/ecclesia-deis-advice-to-institute-of.html
SSPX -DICI SAYS ECCLESIA DEI HAS ASKED THE INSTITUTE OF THE GOOD SHEPHARD TO FOLLOW THE CATECHISM
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2012/04/sspx-dici-says-ecclesia-dei-has-asked.html
DOMINICAN, FRANCISCAN FRIARS OF THE IMMACULATE AND DIOCESAN PRIESTS NEGATE POPE BENEDICT’S OVERSIGHT AND THAT OF THE CONGREGATION FOR THE DOCTRINE OF THE FAITH
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2012/04/dominican-franciscan-friars-of.html
Cardinal Luiz Ladaria, Bishop Charles Morerod O.P Oath of Fidelity: to dissent
Profession of Faith allows for dissent on ecclesiology and baptism
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2012/04/cardinal-luiz-ladaria-bishop-charles.html
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